Yeah, I’m not a huge fan of the renderings. They seem to not really show much besides an artists rendition and seem more a response to recent political pressure than a decent update, at least to me

I read the post three times. Maybe it’s because its the middle of the night but I don’t understand how the content matches the title, what the content is about, or why the OP has mostly upvotes

Bad content with new tools isn’t a new issue for sure… but it seems pretty dominant in places

Another example is/was every time a space X launch happening (particularly starship) if you search space x or elon musk on youtube. That used to be pretty crypto currency targeted slop though

Where did I say that I think that not knowing with certainty implies the practice should be done?

I asked how we could know because it seems kind of tough to validate and that makes it interesting

Great reply, thanks.

nobody wants to be circumcised unless it’s all they’ve known

Yeah, that’s pretty solid. With what I’ve learnt in the last 24 or so hours (so I’m a clear expert) it seems like it could still be true that young children will not remember and that they heal differently so that there isn’t a diminishing feeling or the diminished feeling only happens with botched operations / poor healing or an unlucky few. None of those arguments seem solid though. I’m curious to see info on those points if anyone has it

When I read this, it seemed like an attempt at a pithy comment that included a logical fallacy but I couldn’t put my finger on it. I think I have it now.

If you take the position that’s basically the opposite of the posters and simplify you could end up with an imaginary world with features like: circumcisions cause no lasting pain and have no effect on sexual sensation. In that world, trying to make sure there are less circumcisions is still pretty reasonable, you’re cutting up a baby for no reason. But what behaviour would you expect to see from people in this thread? I’d expect to only see circumcised people saying that many of the comments in this thread didn’t reflect their experience and for people opposed to circumcision to take those comments as defending the practice. Only circumcised people saying that a lot of these comments don’t reflect their experience would also be a quality in worlds where:

• circumcised people are trying to legitimise an experience they went through since otherwise they may have lost something for nothing, or
• there are strong religious groups trying to push for the practice of circumcision.

The fact that only circumcised people are saying a lot of these comments don’t reflect their experience doesn’t give us information about which of these worlds we live in (or more realistically, how much of each is part of our world since the last two obviously have some effect)

People’s personal comments about their experiences before and after the operation do help differentiate, but that wasn’t part of the pithy comment.

True, and if you kind of remove the Muslim map from the circumcision map I think you’re roughly left with the US, Canada and Australia. I originally thought British colonies, but a lot of the commonwealth doesn’t circumcise much. It’s not even British colonies that are still christian, since the UK doesn’t seem to circumcise much.

Anyway, I wonder why it’s these non-Muslim countries. I don’t think the Kellogg-masturbation narrative would have had that strong a hold in Australia, but I’ve been wrong a lot before

No, I clearly don’t know what it feels like for an uncircumcised person and nothing I have said has come close to that. I’m not pushing back on the idea that it might feel better for an uncircumcised person. I’m pushing back on an outspoken individual hoping to hear from more individuals on this thread

I honestly would be curious to see studies that people thought were trustworthy that showed it one way or another. Accounting for it in an adult is easy (ask before, ask after, large enough sample) but its not inconceivable that it’s different when done on children (they heal better in general and the practice is relatively widespread) and I think a study that managed to do demonstrate difference there would be difficult. That said, most of what I saw at a glance seemed to indicate little change and the voices on this thread seem to be shouting it’s a large change in feeling. It would be nice to be able to account for that difference. And I struggle a little with the idea that there is a large change in most individuals since that would imply it could be feeling a lot better and it already feels amazing enough that it already gets me into plenty of trouble.

Sorry, it both wasn’t clear what you meant, and I thought read in a way other people might completely discount that study. I appreciate my reply pointing out I had asked someone else their experience was probably a bit condescending, but the comment here was just there for clarification since it didn’t read to me as being clear

That’s a hell of a jump. I’m very ignorant on that topic and it’s a minefield. Which is what I suspect you’re aiming for here, baiting.

Back to where we started though… how would they know there is a difference if that’s their baseline experience? And it sounds like you learnt some individuals experiences, it can be risky expanding on those and assuming other people’s experiences are the same. But ironically… asking an individual what their experience was is exactly what I was trying to do when you jumped in

I’m going back to bed and I wouldn’t be super if it’s biased, it’s just what I found when I wondered how you would actually measure this. A minor point though: they didn’t go to Uganda, they reviewed a number of studies and in one of them some other people went to Uganda. (Or I’m failing to read.) Agreed that sounds like a messed up way to do a randomised study. The papers subtitle is “results from a randomized controlled trial of male circumcision for human immunodeficiency virus prevention” and that sounds more reasonable but I’m not going to dig any deeper tonight

I guess it’s probably the abrahamic religions:

My bad

And surprised that map doesn’t line up with this one:

He got around. I keep hearing of things related to him and a lot of it’s not great. I’m skeptical of it working well but nice quote

I’m also skeptical the cultural reasons for circumcision have much to do stopping masturbation or Kellogg when I look at a map of where it’s practiced:

Ahhh… how do you know how they feel?

Personally I don’t feel mutilated nor have I had any issues with sexual pleasure, alone or with other people. It’s news to me this could be an issue.

Looking at the other comments there is a good chance they will reply with something similar but damn you’re pushing a narrative and I think overstepping by speaking for someone here. Especially since you, as you said, already replied to me with the same message / assumption.

This study doing an analysis of the research doesn’t seem to agree:

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7691872/

A lot of comments in this thread agree with you though. Where did you get your information to be so confident?

Why are you thankful?

How does it stop boys from masturbating?

Yeah, I started on Voyager. Seeing channels and sidebar for the instance my account is registered to works and easy to find / navigate to.

For other instances, you say that you have to “go” to the other instance. I find it easy to go to a known community on the other instance. And I find it easy to find the sidebar for a known community on another instance. How do I go to the other instance and not the community though?

For example on load, it loads Post > Home (I think this is configurable in settings so not everyone but it’s not so important for these steps). Then you can click Communities in the menu. Then if you are subscribed to a community that is on a different instance you can click it and open it. When you open the sidebar, the sidebar is for that community, not the instance. I see no way to:

• Click on the instance
• Open the sidebar for the instance (not the community)
• See a list of channels on that instance

I clicked around a little, but sorry if I’m missing something obvious.

As an example of the difference in the sidebar for different instances you load these two URLs and compare:

• https://mander.xyz/
• https://lemmy.ml/

And the channels that would be nice to scroll separately are:

• https://mander.xyz/communities
• https://lemmy.ml/communities

Interestingly though, the sidebar for lemmy.ml doesn’t say much and wouldn’t have helped me with the behaviour that caused me to drop “asklemmy@lemmy.ml”. Someone explicitly said that the ml stood for Marxist Leninists and plenty of users tends to write as if that’s true and also be a bit more militant / ideological than I prefer in my interactions… but it’s completely missing from any mention in the sidebar.

What page I’m on. I’ve tried a few things that basically open you to the start again. Especially with PDFs (so opening research papers on the iPhone. Thats not really self hosting but part of the system that needs to work together).

I’ll update the post so people get this in first pass. Thanks!